#218: The Reality of Lawyer Training (Who Should Do It, What To Do)

[00:01:04] Hello. Hello everybody. Welcome to Life & Law. This is your host, Heather Moulder, and today we are talking about lawyer training. Associate training to be more appropriate.

I have had two scenarios happen within the last six months that spurred today's podcast. I'm going to give you both scenarios and then we're going to talk a little bit about the questions that were raised by both of these, probably in a little bit different order, but the questions that were raised. And then we're going to get into how to train associates without it taking up way too much of your time. Because I know your time is limited and it is very valuable. But you're not going to be surprised to hear, I hope that that doesn't mean you shouldn't be training younger attorneys. So here are the two scenarios.

Common Law Firm Issues Around Lawyer Training

[00:01:54] The first one was a partner who typically takes on most of the associate training within her office.

And I think a lot of it has to do with the fact that she does enjoy it. She tends to lead the associate-related committees, and so she goes all in, wholeheartedly into the associate training. Which is fine to some extent. But what she's finding is that although she is taking on all of these more structured roles and other partners don't have to, nor do they want to, the other partners are often seeing it as:

Well. She's taken that on. Great for her, but that means I don't have to. And even worse, in trying to get other partners on board with some of the associate training, she's getting some pushback in the form of "I don't think they need that type of handholding. I don't remember getting it myself."

So that was scenario number one.

[00:02:54] Scenario number two was a question asked of me on LinkedIn through my messaging with a senior associate who is probably about two years away from making partner. O partnership track, but really struggling with the attorney training requirements because of all of the billables that are required due to the client management and client development that is now being required of him as he moves up the ranks.

And the specific question was, how on earth do I do this? Is it truly expected? Was kind of number one, do I really need to be doing this to make partner? And two, if so, okay, well how, how do I fit it in given all of the other things I'm expected to do?

[00:03:39] These two scenarios happened within a couple of months of one another, and they seem unrelated in some ways, but they're not. They're very related. They're really about what training is needed and who should be doing the training. And then how do we do the training.

What Training Is Even Needed?

So let me start with what training is needed.

Basic Day-To-Day Lawyering (Not Taught In Law School)

[00:04:02] I think younger to mid-level associates and even senior associates are well aware that law school does not prepare us to practice law. Right?

And partners, when they sit back and really think about it, know this too. We all know it. But the further away we get from how junior we were at one point, and frankly, how green we were the first couple of years of our practice, the quicker we forget that we really knew nothing.

[00:04:31] Young attorneys must be trained. And they don't need to be trained on everything because some things they just get intuitively, and somewhat this will depend upon the person. But all of them need to, you know, be trained on the how, the, you know, how to do the job, the requirements that they need, the, you know, the, the, the day to day basics of what the expectations are given the work product that you expect from them, given the assignment that you're giving them.

Client Relations

But they need more than that. And I think people kind of understand, okay, somebody needs to tell them what it is we expect, give them some ideas of where to get started and start training that way. Yes, you do. But sometimes you need even more basics and you forget that they just really know nothing. They're very, very green and they don't even understand basic client relations and interactions and what is and is not okay to, to do or say with clients. And although they may not be dealing with clients one-to-one, early on, eventually they will. And so you should be teaching them that from the very beginning.

[00:05:42] And I realize that a lot of people think, wait, that's ridiculous, shouldn't they understand that? My question to you is if they've never worked in the real world and they've gone straight through from high school, to college, to law school, to your law firm. How would they know?

They probably wouldn't. Unless they've already worked. Unless they're one of those lucky folks that you've gotten who worked for a number of years in the real world and then went back to law school, they aren't going to have a clue.

[00:06:10] So there is a lot to teach and a lot for them to learn. It's not just the legal training, it's the day-to-day expectations that you've got to train them on. And frankly, they're smart, they're intuitive, they will figure things out, but they'll figure it out more quickly and to your expectations, and they will meet your expectations so much better if you take this on proactively from the beginning.

Who Should Provide the Lawyer Training?

[00:06:37] Now let's get into who who needs to be training other attorneys? I would say all of the above. Mid-level associates, senior associates, and paralegals can really help with that. Young partners, senior partners, even.

All of the above.

And for those partners out there who kind of have the attitude, and I know this is easy to get because we didn't always get the best training, we had to figure things out for ourselves. Why would you want somebody else to have to go through that?

The Benefits of Training Others

Number one, don't you want to pay it forward just a little bit better to the younger people within the profession? Don't you want to make the profession your law firm, the culture, even better? I would certainly hope so.

[00:07:26] Which is why I encourage and frankly insist that you start taking on more training opportunities. Just note that it gives back to you as much as you give to them. There's a relationship that gets built. It helps to inspire you, it helps you to feel good about the profession and the state of your law firm and even your practice. And for who will one day succeed you and take over.

It is actually more motivating on a day-to-day basis when you have these relationships, these mentoring and training relationships with younger attorneys.

Partners (Who Don't Want to Train): Time To Act Like A Partner

But I'm also going to note something here. For the partners out there, you're a partner, you need to act like it.

[00:08:15] I'm sorry to say, but becoming a partner isn't just about getting a title next to your name and making more money.

 It is also about taking on certain responsibilities for your law firm, for the practice, your practice, the overarching group or teams practice. And if you're in a bigger firm, the law firm as well, you are agreeing to take on certain responsibilities by saying yes to partnership.

This is one of those things and I really want you to take that seriously. Again, lean into the benefits that you're going to get from it as well. Pay attention to how it benefits you so that it becomes more motivating and you're willing to take that time.

Associates Should Train, Too (Sooner Than You Think)

[00:09:07] Now, when it comes to non-partners, yes, you are also expected to train.

And in fact you can start training within the first couple of years. So if you've been there two or three years, you can help those first years you can help them with, okay, here's what they mean when they say that, oh, this is one of those things that they're asking you to do. I used to do that all the time. Here's a checklist I made. Here's. Let's go through this step by step by step. It is up, it is on you, it will help again that person, which will hopefully make you feel good, but it will also help your own leadership skills, it will help with your own professional development and it will help with creating a much more collaborative culture and environment which we all claim to want.

[00:09:58] So even at a young age, as soon as you can start training, that is, you know enough to be able to train on certain things, take those opportunities to do so, and the more senior you get, the more training you are going to be expected to do.

Unfortunately, for those of you who are senior, senior attorneys, especially those of you wanting to make partner, it will be expected that you are training. It will be expected that you take on a bulk of that training. And this goes for young partners at a lot of firms too.

It's the senior associates and young partners, I. E. The first three to five years of your partnership and the last three years or so of your being an associate, where you are going to be expected by many in the firm to do a bulk of that training. Now, yes, others should be doing it, but it will be very much on you.

[00:10:56] And again, I don't think it should be, but that is how it is in a lot of places. Those are the expectations.

The thing I would say for every single one of you is it's not easy. It's not supposed to be easy, but it's part of becoming a good leader. It's part of being more inspirational. It actually helps to build up your confidence when you get good at teaching others and it helps to develop more collaborative relationships with team members.

[00:11:32] So there's a lot of good, there's a lot of back and forth focus in on that when you are taking the time to train because yes, it is going to take some time.

Lawyer Training Tips (For Less Time Spent, Better ROI)

Now let's get to the third piece, which is a large portion of that conversation I had with that senior associate who asked this question around. Okay, how do I do this? When I'm expected to have high billables, when I'm expected to start developing my own book, when I'm expected to pay attention to some of my own professional development, when I'm expected to step up and manage deals or cases, and I have a lot more law practice, management, client management going on, I only have so much time. How do I fit this in too?

[00:12:19] Three things to help you manage this.

Number one, calendar time for mentoring and training.

[00:12:26] So it could be a monthly lunch or coffee. It could be a weekly 20 or 30 minute meeting in your office.

It can be done in many ways.

What I would say is it's going to depend on who it is you're training, what their level is, how many people. If we're talking about one junior associate, that might be a 20 minute meeting every week because you're working with them so closely all the time. If we're talking three different people in your group and you work with them differently at different times and in different ways, and sometimes more than others, Maybe you have a monthly lunch with all of them, not individually. Okay.

[00:13:05] Or maybe you have a separate meeting with each of them for 30 minutes once a month or every other month.

You're going to need to figure out what will work best for you and them based on your personality, based on your schedule, based on their schedule, based on their personality.

[00:13:23] And the reason for this meeting, this regular meeting, is because we can't always give full feedback in the moment when they give you something back and you're on a time deadline and you revise it. And yes, then you would hope that they go redline it and take a look at it, but they should have questions. You will have things that you'll have noted that you need to talk to them about. Start noting those things, log it, keep it somewhere. And then when you have this monthly or every other month meeting or quick weekly meeting, you will have things to give them constructive feedback on.

This is necessary because otherwise we forget and we let things drop and then they don't hear about it until it's their year end review and it's something they could have known earlier and they could have worked on. And the reason you want to do this is because you want to start giving them feedback quickly and often so that they have an opportunity to fix things and do better them understanding where they need to work and what to work on and how is how they actually become good lawyers, which is how they take on more and more work, which is how they start to free up more of your time, which is how you're able to delegate more and more and more to them. So you need to have very clear systemization and processes for capturing what it is they're doing and the feedback you want to give and then having time set aside for actually doing that.

[00:14:56] Trust me when I say that little bit. Maybe it's 20 minutes per week or 30 minutes per month or an hour lunch every other month. Don't go longer than that. By the way, it's going to pay you back so much. Over the course of 6, 12, 18 months, you will see much better results with these associates, with the work that they're doing and how much more they can help you. Now, one thing I will note on this is you need to set clear boundaries around what is and is not okay. What I mean by that is what are valid questions, what are valid things for them to get help with you on? You must set boundaries. And I talked about this more specifically in an episode a while back around mentorship. So I'm going to put a link to that episode in there so that you can get more guidance if you need it, around the types of boundaries you want to be setting with those that you're mentoring and training because you want to make sure they understand when to come to you, what to come to you about, and how you're going to give feedback.

[00:15:59] All right, so that's number one.

Number two, over the course of time, you need to narrow down the who.

[00:16:06] And here's what I mean by that. Some people are going to listen more. Some people are going to take to your feedback. Some people are going to admit to their mistakes. Some people are going to work harder as a result of those mistakes. Some people are going to have a desire to be taught and want to learn.

Some are not.

[00:16:24] Do not assume you know number one. And be sure to give enough time for brand-new associates. You really need to give that whole first year for somebody who's been there a while, or let's say somebody who practiced for four years and then moved over, I'd say six months.

Six months of setting clear boundaries, calendaring that time for training and mentoring, giving feedback, seeing how they respond, seeing what's going on.

ou are going to want to narrow down the who because some people are not going to take your feedback. And sometimes that's a personality issue that they just don't take it well from your personality. You guys don't sync upright. That's okay, find the right person who does, because again, not everybody should be mentoring everyone.

[00:17:14] Over time, you really kind of have to hone in on the people that you're going to mentor the most. It doesn't mean you don't train and delegate to some others, but you're going to have natural affinities for some people, and other senior associates and partners will have natural affinities with others. So figure out who those people are and then also start talking to your fellow senior associates and the partners that you work with around who is and is not listening and why.

Because sometimes you're going to get some tips on, oh, this person has a, this is how it's easier to deliver that news and they'll take it, which will work better for you. So you want to listen to that, right? Other times it's going to be, yeah, we're having the same problem. Maybe we need to put on. Put them on a performance improvement plan. Maybe this isn't the right fit for them. The fact of the matter is, not everybody is the right fit everywhere.

So narrow down the who, because ultimately you are not going to be training if it's a big group, you're not gonna be training everybody all the time. You're gonna hone in on the people that make most sense.

Third, know how to write billing narratives.

[00:18:20] The third thing, and this is going to be potentially surprising to you. But maybe not after having Molly Kremer, the billing coach, on my podcast recently, know how to write billing narratives.

So what I find is a lot of people feel like they lose too much time when they spend it training others because it's meeting, it's explaining, it's discussing, it's reviewing. It's all of these things that they're doing right. And they don't know how to write a proper billing narrative, so they don't even bill for it.

[00:18:54] Know how to write your billing narrative, and if you don't know and you're not sure, number one, go back and listen. Or re. Listen to my interview with Molly Kramer, the billing coach. She got into this about talking about, you know, writing narratives in a way that showcases the value you're actually providing to the client. And then go follow her on LinkedIn and maybe even consider reaching out or taking one of her workshops, because she does teach people how to do that.

Final note, I hear this comment a lot. Hand holding. Why do they need such hand-holding? Look, your people will be as good as the training they get.

[00:19:36] Spend the time up front to train them so that you can have people who will one day be autonomous and independent, giving you excellent legal work, understanding your own personality, your likes and dislikes, and how to tailor the work they're doing to you uniquely.

That is what you get through really good, effective associate training.

All right, that's it for today's episode. We will be back next week with another one. Bye for now.